‘I knew my job was to fulfil a man’s fantasy’: Elizabeth McGovern on Downton, early fame and co-starring with Brad Pitt | Movies

For the maudlin amongst us, the ultimate Downton Abbey movie ought to maybe include a warning. The whole lot in it’s tinged with wistfulness – a goodbye to cherished characters and a farewell to a stately house that was a sturdy presence in a transient world. When the ITV collection began in 2010, wasn’t life … higher? Did Elizabeth McGovern really feel this too, the sense of time passing? In any case, her character, Cora, is now ageing out of custodianship of Downton alongside along with her husband, Lord Grantham, in favour of a youthful technology and a altering period because the Thirties daybreak.“No!” says McGovern, snapping me out of my melancholy. “I really feel very excited that I’m going right into a gratifying new part in my profession.” In addition to reviving Cora, there may be the play she has written, Ava: The Secret Conversations. Starring McGovern as Hollywood actor Ava Gardner, it’ll run in New York, Chicago and Toronto, having made its debut in London in 2022. There may be additionally a brand new album of her folk-inspired music. “I really feel like I’m simply starting,” she declares as we meet at her publicist’s London workplace. At first look, McGovern, fine-boned and composed, appears delicate – however in case you solely go on first impressions, you’ll miss her rebellious spirit.I used to be by no means determined. I might stroll away. A number of younger ladies weren’t so luckyNot that making Downton Abbey: The Grand Finale wasn’t emotional. “You don’t need to work very onerous, as a film-maker, to the touch on that depth, as a result of we’ve been engaged on it for thus a few years,” she says. McGovern apprehensive that the absence of Maggie Smith – who died final 12 months after giving the present the brilliantly scathing Dowager Countess – would really feel like too huge a loss to the Downton world. However she says Smith’s presence “permeates” it. “She’s nonetheless very a lot within the environment. I don’t really feel there’s an enormous gap. Actually, in some methods, it kind of freed up the remainder of the narrative to have a movement, as a result of it’s not stopping for her moments. However all the pieces she represents is there. She’s in each room, in each interplay, so it’s not like she’s not there. It’s a bizarre factor.”Heroine heiress … as Cora (centre) in The Grand Finale. {Photograph}: Rory Mulvey/Focus FeaturesThe ladies of Downton, whether or not the steely Woman Mary or spirited younger prepare dinner Daisy, are gratifyingly robust, however Cora, often quietly supportive within the background, by no means appeared that strong, though it was her cash – as an American heiress – that was working all the pieces. Was that tough to play? “At occasions, sure,” says McGovern. “I feel as a recent lady, it’s onerous to really feel the straitjacket of that interval.” Did she ever combat for Cora to have extra company? “I want at occasions she might have had extra attention-grabbing tales,” says McGovern, however provides that it wouldn’t have been acceptable for her to have had “any extra political or social energy, as a result of it simply wouldn’t be correct to the time”.Cora, although, is a imaginative and prescient of an thrilling America; the daughter of a Jewish immigrant put in at Downton along with her baggage of recent cash and her progressive outlook. Have been Downton set now, as an alternative of Cora coming right here to shake up Britain’s class-ridden methods, she can be a rich liberal refugee, a bit like Ellen DeGeneres, fleeing Trump’s America. McGovern, who grew up in California, has lived within the UK for the previous 32 years. She is shocked and disillusioned at fashionable US politics.“I imply,” she says, “it’s a actuality that will need to have been effervescent away beneath what I believed was America. It could possibly’t have come from nowhere.” However, describing herself as a constructive particular person, she provides: “I feel it will likely be painful, however we’ve got an excessive amount of profitable historical past as a free nation for us to let it go. It’s all of our duty to peacefully be certain that we maintain on to all the pieces that I used to be assured – and complacent about – that America represented.”Large time … with Robert De Niro in As soon as Upon a Time in America. {Photograph}: Everett Assortment/AlamyMcGovern had large success early on. Her debut was in Robert Redford’s 1980 movie Extraordinary Individuals, and she or he received an Oscar nomination for her position in her second movie, Ragtime. This was adopted by an element in Sergio Leone’s As soon as Upon a Time in America, reverse Robert de Niro. “I feel I did really feel like, ‘Gosh, this isn’t as onerous as individuals say.’” She smiles. “Till I later skilled how tough it’s. My expertise early on was simply attempting to maintain my head on straight, do job after job, and do what most individuals are doing at that age – attempt to develop up. I solely realised later how tough it’s to maintain a profession.”Hers wasn’t a showbiz household: her mother and father had been academics. And though she has liked performing since she was a baby, it was by no means about turning into a star. As a younger lady in an typically harmful trade, this most likely protected her. “I used to be by no means determined, so I might all the time simply stroll away. A number of younger ladies didn’t really feel they might. I feel I used to be very fortunate.”It additionally made her see the downsides of fame. “I feel I did handle to keep away from it myself, however the value you pay for fame is that it turns into actually onerous to have any relationships of intimacy, since you are collateral. Your complete being has kind of been offered, and that creates a rigidity about what individuals need from you.”A number of McGovern’s early roles had been because the girlfriend to the male lead. Then, she says: “I went from being the girlfriend to the right spouse, and that I discovered irritating. Most films, tv – it’s all the time the person’s viewpoint. It’s such a deep, subliminal factor that audiences are usually not even conscious of it. I wasn’t even significantly conscious of it. I knew my job early on was to fulfil a person’s fantasy of the girl they needed. It by no means occurred to me to even query it.”‘I’ve performed my very own factor’ … with Brad Pitt as her boyfriend in The Favor; now she thinks she can be solid as his mom. {Photograph}: Orion Footage/AllstarBrad Pitt performed McGovern’s boyfriend within the 1994 comedy The Favor. We joke – bitterly – that had been she to be in a movie with him now, she would most likely be solid as his mom. This says loads about what’s nonetheless thought-about fascinating in a lady though, at 64, McGovern is just three years Pitt’s senior. “I actually don’t suppose that, simply because society is viewing one thing that means, we’ve got to. I attempt to have this dialogue with my daughters. We are able to have a sense unbiased of the consensus in society. I’ve simply performed my very own factor and simply saved doing it.”She bristles, not unreasonably, after I level out that her embracing her silver hair appears uncommon in her enterprise. Was {that a} political determination? “Probably not. However as soon as once more, I really feel like a lady my age – that’s what we’re requested to speak about. I remorse that about society.”There’s something bracing about the way in which McGovern carves her personal path. She left Hollywood and moved to London to begin a household; she has two grownup daughters along with her husband, the film-maker and producer Simon Curtis (who directed The Grand Finale). Approaching her 40s, she began a band, Sadie and the Hotheads, and began releasing music. “I’ve to remind myself,” she says, “that individuals will both prefer it or they received’t – and no matter they really feel is ok with me. It’s about doing it.”In her 50s, she wrote her play about Gardner, drawn to the actor’s unbiased spirit. Now in her 60s, she is writing a screenplay, though she received’t say what it’s about. “It’s my subsequent obsession. I actually wish to write stuff. I’m actually enthusiastic about that.” Doing so is partly a solution to create attention-grabbing work for herself as an older actor. There has actually been loads of speak about this – does she suppose the scenario has improved? “Not that I’ve seen.”Unbiased spirit … with Aaron Costa Ganis in Ava: The Secret Conversations in New York. {Photograph}: Jeff Lorch/APShe liked the latest present Dying for Intercourse, by which Michelle Williams performs a terminally sick lady in her 40s who embarks on a final try at sexual exploration. “It’s such a feminine story. I discovered that to be actually encouraging, but it surely’s not going to be about somebody my age.” Why? Is it as a result of society considers the considered older ladies having a intercourse life stunning? “I feel presumably, sure. I imply, what can we do as ladies, besides simply preserve going and never purchase into it? Now we have no different selection.”If it takes a little bit of effort, the pay-off is unquestionably value it – if McGovern and her outlook are something to go by. “It’s a each day train in getting your head tuned into the appropriate factor. It’s not that I blame anybody for accepting the established order, but it surely doesn’t imply I’ve to. No means.” She laughs. “No means.” Downton Abbey: The Grand Finale is out on 11 September in Australia, and 12 September within the UK and US. Ava: The Secret Conversations is at New York Metropolis Heart till 14 September.